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    We got a third offensive line commitment this week....

    Kid named Clipper Jr. out of Georgia. A three star, but with a 4 or 5 star offer list.

    https://www.rockytoptalk.com/2021/7/...all-recruiting

    6'4" 299 pound tackle.

    Why can't we all just get along?

    #2
    Originally posted by Polemicvol View Post
    Kid named Clipper Jr. out of Georgia. A three star, but with a 4 or 5 star offer list.

    https://www.rockytoptalk.com/2021/7/...all-recruiting

    6'4" 299 pound tackle.
    From my old neighborhood.

    Sent from my SM-J737V using Tapatalk

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      #3
      I trust the new o-line coach a lot more than our old Friend.

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        #4
        Originally posted by Constipated View Post
        I trust the new o-line coach a lot more than our old Friend.
        Damn straight.

        Sent from my SM-J737V using Tapatalk

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          #5
          Originally posted by Spawn of Tennstud View Post
          Damn straight.
          What I like about Coach Hype's offense, and saw it in action in the orange and white game, is how he lets the offensive line block downhill on the defenders. They seem to fire out on every play and hit the defenders and move the line of scrimmage.

          Then the quarterback reads run or pass. And they just pick the defense apart by knocking them on their heels.

          It looks like a short run, then it's actually 5 or 6 yards, because the OL moved the LOS and the back 7 can't help, cause they are so scared of the vertical passing game.

          It's fun to watch and I bet it's a lot of fun for offensive linemen. And a nightmare for defenders.



          Why can't we all just get along?

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            #6
            Better than Blockindaback I guess.

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              #7
              Originally posted by coachwatch View Post
              Better than Blockindaback I guess.
              LOL.

              Comment


                #8
                Originally posted by Spawn of Tennstud View Post
                Damn straight.

                Sent from my SM-J737V using Tapatalk
                I heard that


                Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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                  #9
                  Originally posted by Constipated View Post
                  I trust the new o-line coach a lot more than our old Friend.
                  I don’t understand how our Friend keeps getting jobs. Left us got the OL job at SC, stayed about two weeks then got hired at Auburn. He’s awful


                  Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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                    #10
                    Originally posted by Polemicvol View Post

                    What I like about Coach Hype's offense, and saw it in action in the orange and white game, is how he lets the offensive line block downhill on the defenders. They seem to fire out on every play and hit the defenders and move the line of scrimmage.

                    Then the quarterback reads run or pass. And they just pick the defense apart by knocking them on their heels.

                    It looks like a short run, then it's actually 5 or 6 yards, because the OL moved the LOS and the back 7 can't help, cause they are so scared of the vertical passing game.

                    It's fun to watch and I bet it's a lot of fun for offensive linemen. And a nightmare for defenders.

                    One problem with your theory.....if the offensive line charges upfield....and the qb decides to pass.....it's a penalty....Illegal man (men) downfield if any of those wild chargers went 3 yards or more. So that innovative Huepel and his rpo....needs to reign in his o-line just a tad if they're running plays as you have described.......
                    Mine's Bigger

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                      #11
                      Originally posted by Orangebutt View Post

                      One problem with your theory.....if the offensive line charges upfield....and the qb decides to pass.....it's a penalty....Illegal man (men) downfield if any of those wild chargers went 3 yards or more. So that innovative Huepel and his rpo....needs to reign in his o-line just a tad if they're running plays as you have described.......
                      You noticed that too. As long as the ball comes out quick, it's fine, but if the qb pats it even once it's illegal downfield.


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                        #12
                        Originally posted by InspectorVol View Post

                        You noticed that too. As long as the ball comes out quick, it's fine, but if the qb pats it even once it's illegal downfield.
                        One way to be sure that you aren't penalized for a lineman down field, is to teach the qb that if they have to go past three on a decision to pass, then they need to just run the ball. Quarterbacks have a view of the entire field and they should be coached to recognize if too much time has passed and their linemen are too far down field. Plus, defenses have huge problems stopping a running quarterback.

                        Offensive linemen also know to pull up a bit after three yards, if they aren't sure it's a run.

                        Thirdly, refs tend not to call this much against RPO teams. Three yards stretches into 5 yards, and unless one lineman gets way out ahead of the rest, then you normally don't see a flag. At least I seldom saw them against teams who routinely ran this against us.

                        It's so subjective and really can't be called until after it's clearly a pass play. And it's such a productive system that it's worth the risk. When your OL gets aggressive, it's nearly impossible to get a sack on the quarterback. Because every play looks like a run for the first three seconds. They can't load up on a pass rush.

                        Plus you are playing on your opponent's side of the line of scrimmage. It makes it much easier to run the ball and to get first downs. So a few OLmen down field penalties of 5 yards is a good trade for such a productive offensive system.

                        Lastly, the penalty isn't three yards past the LOS. It's three yards past the neutral zone, which basically is the length of the football. But in real practice, it's a bit more than that, as defenders don't want to chance that penalty, so they back up a bit more. So that really makes the downfield penalty more like 3.5 to 4 yards. Most of the time you don't see the penalty called unless an OLman is 5 yards down field, so that he is clearly and obviously violating the rule. The benefit of the doubt seems to go to offenses.

                        Unless the NCAA decides to favor defenses and make that call a point of emphasis next season, then it's a fairly low risk issue for offenses. If they call it four times a game, which almost never happens, that's only 20 yards total in penalties, barely more than one 15 yarder. And your offense is shredding the defense for 7 or 8 yards a play (or more), so it's been well worth the risk for OCs.

                        And in Coach Hype's offense, at least half of all plays end up as a run. So that penalty can't be called on those run plays. Which means it only applies half the time or less. Math matters.

                        But sometimes you have a spectacular pass play called back for this penalty. That sucks, but I'll trade it for scoring 7 or 8 TDs a game and gaining 600 or so yards a game.

                        Coach Hype's offense is based on reading the defense and timing. He seems to know how to run this offense without getting tripped up by too many lineman down field penalties. If the reads and timing are correct, you aren't gonna have this penalty. It's really on the shoulders of the qb.

                        It forces your qb to be decisive and to be so quickly. Not the best offense for a gitmo type qb, but Cheney tried to run RPOs at times with gitmo. What a fucking disaster, you run an offense play that requires a dumbass qb to both read the defense correctly and get rid of the ball quickly, two things gitmo rarely did right. No wonder our offense sucked last year.

                        I think Coach Hype knows better than to put a dumbass in our quarterback position. I think he knows how to drill and coach them to play within the rules.




                        Last edited by Polemicvol; July 12, 2021, 08:43 AM.
                        Why can't we all just get along?

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                          #13
                          Originally posted by Constipated View Post
                          I trust the new o-line coach a lot more than our old Friend.
                          Why do you say that? Not backing Friend at all but why do you trust and unknown OL Coach from UCF who was brought to UT because Assistant Coaches (and recruits) around the country do NOT trust UT Administration and UTAD to have their back and support them. So Mott the Huepel brought more than half his assistants from UCF. Not sure why you can say you "trust" some unknown OL coach who is getting commits from 3* players.
                          "INSIDE EVERY PROGRESSIVE IS A TOTALITARIAN SCREAMING TO GET OUT"

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                            #14
                            Originally posted by Polemicvol View Post

                            One way to be sure that you aren't penalized for a lineman down field, is to teach the qb that if they have to go past three on a decision to pass, then they need to just run the ball. Quarterbacks have a view of the entire field and they should be coached to recognize if too much time has passed and their linemen are too far down field. Plus, defenses have huge problems stopping a running quarterback.

                            Offensive linemen also know to pull up a bit after three yards, if they aren't sure it's a run.

                            Thirdly, refs tend not to call this much against RPO teams. Three yards stretches into 5 yards, and unless one lineman gets way out ahead of the rest, then you normally don't see a flag. At least I seldom saw them against teams who routinely ran this against us.

                            It's so subjective and really can't be called until after it's clearly a pass play. And it's such a productive system that it's worth the risk. When your OL gets aggressive, it's nearly impossible to get a sack on the quarterback. Because every play looks like a run for the first three seconds. They can't load up on a pass rush.

                            Plus you are playing on your opponent's side of the line of scrimmage. It makes it much easier to run the ball and to get first downs. So a few OLmen down field penalties of 5 yards is a good trade for such a productive offensive system.

                            Lastly, the penalty isn't three yards past the LOS. It's three yards past the neutral zone, which basically is the length of the football. But in real practice, it's a bit more than that, as defenders don't want to chance that penalty, so they back up a bit more. So that really makes the downfield penalty more like 3.5 to 4 yards. Most of the time you don't see the penalty called unless an OLman is 5 yards down field, so that he is clearly and obviously violating the rule. The benefit of the doubt seems to go to offenses.

                            Unless the NCAA decides to favor defenses and make that call a point of emphasis next season, then it's a fairly low risk issue for offenses. If they call it four times a game, which almost never happens, that's only 20 yards total in penalties, barely more than one 15 yarder. And your offense is shredding the defense for 7 or 8 yards a play (or more), so it's been well worth the risk for OCs.

                            And in Coach Hype's offense, at least half of all plays end up as a run. So that penalty can't be called on those run plays. Which means it only applies half the time or less. Math matters.

                            But sometimes you have a spectacular pass play called back for this penalty. That sucks, but I'll trade it for scoring 7 or 8 TDs a game and gaining 600 or so yards a game.

                            Coach Hype's offense is based on reading the defense and timing. He seems to know how to run this offense without getting tripped up by too many lineman down field penalties. If the reads and timing is correct, you aren't gonna have this penalty. It's really on the shoulders of the qb.



                            I'm probably wasting my time....as we'll likely get another wall of "guessing as you go"....but I'll give it a shot. Your RPO decision is almost immediately after the snap...and it's not going to revert to a long pass upfield unless there's a clear advantage right out of the gate. Much of what's going to happen is based on pre-snap reads...NOT what's going on 3 seconds after the snap. It's not like we're rolling the dice and hoping the refs don't notice. Also....it's NOT the fact that you lost 20 extra yards due to penalties....it's the fact you've got 3 downs and if one of them ends up taking you backwards, the chances of a first down in that series go way, way down. Having four of your maybe.....10 offensive possessions get altered by "rolling the dice" would be a critical problem....particularly when we're going to probably have to score 40 points a game if we're going to win.
                            Mine's Bigger

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                              #15
                              Originally posted by Orangebutt View Post

                              I'm probably wasting my time...
                              Ain’t no probably about it


                              Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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                                #16
                                Originally posted by Orangebutt View Post

                                I'm probably wasting my time....as we'll likely get another wall of "guessing as you go"....but I'll give it a shot. Your RPO decision is almost immediately after the snap...and it's not going to revert to a long pass upfield unless there's a clear advantage right out of the gate. Much of what's going to happen is based on pre-snap reads...NOT what's going on 3 seconds after the snap. It's not like we're rolling the dice and hoping the refs don't notice. Also....it's NOT the fact that you lost 20 extra yards due to penalties....it's the fact you've got 3 downs and if one of them ends up taking you backwards, the chances of a first down in that series go way, way down. Having four of your maybe.....10 offensive possessions get altered by "rolling the dice" would be a critical problem....particularly when we're going to probably have to score 40 points a game if we're going to win.
                                You simply use less words to guess.

                                All I can go on is what I saw in the Orange and White game. If someone saw something different, please share it with me, I didn't watch every single down with great intensity.

                                I am speculating on the wisdom of disguising every play as a run, with your OL blocking scheme and RPO game. We might not do that on every play, but I saw it a bunch in the OW game. Sure, there's a risk of a penalty, but there's a risk of a penalty on all sorts of stuff every play.

                                I think it comes down to coaching and can your kids execute the offense properly to avoid penalties of any sort. Coach Hype has pretty well proved his ability to do that and he brought his entire offensive staff with him, so I'm very optimistic that we won't have much of an issue with that.

                                You can't play afraid of making a mistake. Teach your kids the proper way to do things, drill it, then turn them loose on gameday to play ball. As I said before, I'll trade 7 or 8 touchdowns a game and maybe 600 yards offense a game for a few 5 yard ineligible man down field penalty.

                                If that's not few enough words for you, try slowing down when you read them. If you read them, I think usually you don't. You just bitch and moan about nothing.


                                Why can't we all just get along?

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                                  #17
                                  [QUOTE=Polemicvol;n813472]

                                  You simply use less words to guess.

                                  All I can go on is what I saw in the Orange and White game. If someone saw something different, please share it with me, I didn't watch every single down with great intensity.

                                  I am speculating on the wisdom of disguising every play as a run, with your OL blocking scheme and RPO game. We might not do that on every play, but I saw it a bunch in the OW game. Sure, there's a risk of a penalty, but there's a risk of a penalty on all sorts of stuff every play.

                                  I think it comes down to coaching and can your kids execute the offense properly to avoid penalties of any sort. Coach Hype has pretty well proved his ability to do that and he brought his entire offensive staff wly ith him, so I'm very optimistic that we won't have much of an issue with that.

                                  You can't play afraid of making a mistake. Teach your kids the proper way to do things, drill it, then turn them loose on gameday to play ball. As I said before, I'll trade 7 or 8 touchdowns a game and maybe 600 yards offense a game for a few 5 yard ineligible man down field penalty.

                                  If that's not few enough words for you, try slowing down when you read them. If you read them, I think usually you don't. You just bitch and moan about nothing


                                  My only complaint was that I was sharing information with you and you're just to hard headed to listen....and sadly I was right.
                                  Mine's Bigger

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                                    #18
                                    Originally posted by Polemicvol View Post

                                    You simply use less words to guess.

                                    All I can go on is what I saw in the Orange and White game. If someone saw something different, please share it with me, I didn't watch every single down with great intensity.

                                    I am speculating on the wisdom of disguising every play as a run, with your OL blocking scheme and RPO game. We might not do that on every play, but I saw it a bunch in the OW game. Sure, there's a risk of a penalty, but there's a risk of a penalty on all sorts of stuff every play.

                                    I think it comes down to coaching and can your kids execute the offense properly to avoid penalties of any sort. Coach Hype has pretty well proved his ability to do that and he brought his entire offensive staff with him, so I'm very optimistic that we won't have much of an issue with that.

                                    You can't play afraid of making a mistake. Teach your kids the proper way to do things, drill it, then turn them loose on gameday to play ball. As I said before, I'll trade 7 or 8 touchdowns a game and maybe 600 yards offense a game for a few 5 yard ineligible man down field penalty.

                                    If that's not few enough words for you, try slowing down when you read them. If you read them, I think usually you don't. You just bitch and moan about nothing.

                                    In a way, you are correct. The RPO offense is designed to do just what it says run or pass. It’s basically the old single wing offense. The Oline fires out and engages the first level with the QB reading the defender. It’s then the QBs job to determine whether to hand off, pull and run himself, or pass. It is designed to be run quickly, so linemen downfield is really not an issue. If you look at his offense, there are designed passes, but, the scheme is the same for the Oline, engage the first line, in other words, be aggressive.

                                    You have a pretty good take on this.

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                                      #19
                                      Who was the coordinator Butch had that put the D line 2 yards off the ball? Surprised he didn't claim it was a revolutionary approach drawing ineligible men downfield penalties.

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                                        #20
                                        Originally posted by Volgustus McCrae View Post
                                        Who was the coordinator Butch had that put the D line 2 yards off the ball? Surprised he didn't claim it was a revolutionary approach drawing ineligible men downfield penalties.
                                        Janitor John Jancek I believe was Butch’s only DC. Going off memory here, so not 100%

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